Krasnogorsk 3

[dharmabum1949]

Hey everyone,

I have been loving my work in 8mm film and am thinking of picking up a 16mm camera. I am looking for something basic, I'd like to spend between $200-$300. Does anyone have any suggestions? Is this not enough money to pick up something of reasonable quality? I keep running into the Krasnogorsk 3 which is a moderately priced Russian camera with all the basic features i need. Does anyone knwo anyhting about this model? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

[hmc4me]

check out the website for the k3 http://www.k3camera.com/k3/k3s16mm.stm

Lot's of people have told me that the Canon Scoopic is better though.

[dharmabum1949]

I was unaware that there was already a thread discussing this camera, after reading over what i read there I think i may look for the scoopic since it seems to be agreed that it is a better camera for around the same price. Im going to be shopping around ebay and buy/sell boards, could someone give me an idea of what a reasonable price would be for the krasnogorsk-3, Bolex H16, and canon scoopic? I know there are many factors to consider and Im sure theres no one price that can be given but i would like some idea of what I should be paying.

[rollemfilm]

If you plan on trying to shoot sync sound, none of the cameras mentioned are very quiet. But, the Scoopic is a better choice since you don't have to deal with an add on motor and it is the quieter of the three. But only the Scoopic M or MS can do sync with modification. Some Scoopic cameras came from the factory with crystal, most did not. The Bolex H16 would be the better choice for versatility. For the same or a little more money you can do sync and have the option of shooting with the spring motor. The prices range from about $1,000-$1,500 for a Scoopic and then add the crystal for another $500. For the Bolex, $600-$1,200 for a RX 4 or 3, add the lens for about $800.00 and a sync motor for $500. I guess the savings would be on the lens. With the Scoopic
you have the lens.

I have shot with both. The Scoopic is better for hand held shots. The Bolex is clumsy at times but very reliable. Both cameras use a beam splitter reflex system.

If you have $2,000 to spend, get a CP16A or an Arri S, they will serve you better in the long run.

Otherwise, I am fond of the Scoopic.

[hmc4me]

Here is a k3 manual
http://faculty.ncarts.edu/film/manuals/k3_manual.pdf
from the north carolina school of the arts website.
I've been looking at going to this school for a few years now and they use the K3 for the second year film students. I may buy one just to learn how it works. Im looking for a super 16mm camera myself.
Thanks
Anthony

[hmc4me]

If you want a good k3 I know a guy who services them and might be able to get you a good one at a good price. Around $300 may be a little more. Thast a little more than ebay but it has been serviced and that makes it worth the extra money I think.
thanks
Anthony

[dharmabum1949]

I'm not planning on doing sync sound any time soon, if ever really. I'm interested in non-narrative cinema and don't use dialoque in my films. All of the work I'm planning on doing will either be silent or accompanied by some sort of musical composition, most of the filmmakers I'm interested in did the same thing.

I'm also not currently worried about converting to S16. I'm looking for the cheapest camera I can find with decent registration, resolution, a variety of frame rates, and manual exposure control.

One of my main cocnerns with the krasnogorski is that it is a wind-up. I've heard that the spring gives out after a while. Is this something I should be overly concerned with?

[seekaee]

There's ofcourse those old funky cameras from the 50's that you can get as low as $10 bucks on Ebay like the B& H or the Automate. There outdated even by old cameras standards, but they might be the way to go without spending an arm and a leg. Check I'm out.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ November 29, 2003 02:49 PM: Message edited by: seekaee ]</font>

[rollemfilm]

Get a Filmo. A Bell & Howell 70 DR. Although it is a spring dive, it has a major spring that rarley goes bad. If it does you can handcrank the camera. It has a provision for that. It's non-reflex but has great viewfinder optics. These were used as combat cameras in WW2, Korean and Vietnam wars. They were also the main cameras for many TV stations throughout the 1950's-1970's.

As far as a spring going bad, everything can go bad. Electric motors can go bad just as well as a spring. Spring motors are cheaper to use since you have no batteries. I would go with the Bell & Howell or a good Bolex if you are not interested in sync. Go with a Bolex if you want a zoom lens and variable shutter. Bell & Howell for rock steady pictures and low maintenance.

Oh yes. Some of the older Filmos like the 70DA have double pulldown claws. These are great for highspeed shooting or animation but you need to use double perforated film. The 70DA is much cheaper and every bit a great camera, but the later cameras the 70DR and the 70HR will take double & single perforated film. The 70DL is the same as the DR but without the locking viewfinder turret. The HR will take a motor and has a better footage counter.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ November 29, 2003 04:18 PM: Message edited by: rollemfilm ]</font>